Why should Civilians be allowed to help at points?

[Josh_Moore]

As far as Kojiro's alt hanging with civilian friends, and then those friends helping the Yakuza, if it's the civilians' main accounts, I don't have a problem with it assuming Kojiro isn't telling them "((hey come help me at the point))" on his alt.

If the guys helping are civilians, and they know kojiros civ account, I don't see any reason for them to go assist at the point? What connection would they have with the point other than knowing that a friend's alt is LT in a family fighting for it.
Idiots like turtles who I think is made a mistake here, it's sam windmill are annoying because they backstab you while grabbing a gun or smoking pot for your weapon, and run around doing nothing while they can't easily kill you, and If for a second you focus on trying to kill or make them flee some other faction member figting for the point will come and ram you(ill let you guess this one) or backstab you, and since the server isn't that populated anymore there aren't as many family members available to be able to take care about a shitload of bored civs AND 2-3 other factions figting for the point


go on and insult me for telling my point of view, as far as I care you can go suck a cock(this one ain't for ari but for the upcoming comments)

[Ari_Papadopoulos]

As far as Kojiro's alt hanging with civilian friends, and then those friends helping the Yakuza, if it's the civilians' main accounts, I don't have a problem with it assuming Kojiro isn't telling them "((hey come help me at the point))" on his alt.

If the guys helping are civilians, and they know kojiros civ account, I don't see any reason for them to go assist at the point? What connection would they have with the point other than knowing that a friend's alt is LT in a family fighting for it.
Idiots like turtles who I think is made a mistake here, it's sam windmill are annoying because they backstab you while grabbing a gun or smoking pot for your weapon, and run around doing nothing while they can't easily kill you, and If for a second you focus on trying to kill or make them flee some other faction member figting for the point will come and ram you(ill let you guess this one) or backstab you, and since the server isn't that populated anymore there aren't as many family members available to be able to take care about a shitload of bored civs AND 2-3 other factions figting for the point


go on and insult me for telling my point of view, as far as I care you can go suck a cock(this one ain't for ari but for the upcoming comments)

If people are chicken running around, keeping moving until you're distracted, that's bad and you should report them. However, maybe you gangs should make a gentlemen's agreement that you kill of civilians at the point before attack each other?

That said, do you go fuck over Kevin Turtles after the point? Maybe you should be if you aren't.

As far as reasons to be at the point, I go there on my civ accounts to try and grab weapons off the ground and nobody ever shoots at me, so IC it's a pretty desirable place to be.

[80s_Baby]

Well why don't cops come arrest everyone at the point? Why don't the admins fine everyone for death matching? All the families Re basically friends so why would they wanna kill eachother?

[Ari_Papadopoulos]

Well why don't cops come arrest everyone at the point? Why don't the admins fine everyone for death matching? All the families Re basically friends so why would they wanna kill eachother?

The cops don't arrest people at the point because it seems unfair to do so, instead we SU people if we see them fighting and go after them later. We're talking about maybe having cops go after civs at the point, but it's still up in the air - weapon drops change the dynamic a lot. Admins try and stop deathmatching, but it's awfully hard to tell what is and isn't at a point battle, because for all we know people are coming to the point to get back at people that fucked with them earlier, or to collect guns from people who are low on health by blasting them. Really, just ask Freddo how to handle this. I watched him today and he warned people to leave, then shot the shit out of them when they didn't. Consequently there weren't a million civs hanging around the point.

And as far as all the families being friends, remember how this is a roleplay server and you're supposed to play a role so even if you are friends with someone OOC you can still hate them IC??? Remember??? Additionally, you have an IC reason to fight them because there's a direct benefit for your gang winning if you're in one.

[Anthony_Buoni]

The best part would be some sort of other interaction for Civilians while points happen, like fighting eachother to gain something or w/e, kinda of a point system for civs.

[80s_Baby]

Well why don't cops arrest people? Doesn't make sense. If ppl are shooting guns they should arrest them. Civs and cops shouldn't interfere in points full stop. Unless Civs can claim and cops can arrest.

[Chris Hansen]

Well why don't cops arrest people? Doesn't make sense. If ppl are shooting guns they should arrest them. Civs and cops shouldn't interfere in points full stop. Unless Civs can claim and cops can arrest.

It doesn't make sense for cops to go in during the actual fighting because it would likely result in their deaths. It's not so much a ban on cops arresting people, but rather common sense. There have been massive, well-planned raids on points where there were dozens of cops online able to shut down a point after a long IC-investigation into the location of certain points, but that was years ago.

Civilians may not be able to claim points, but they still use points, and so they should be able to help influence who controls the point.

[80s_Baby]

If even other families agree with my complaint, why not ban civilians? I don't care about reasons why they should be there. It sucks. I mean there could be an OOC reason why civilians hate grove st. or yakuza or mafia, so what, they come down to the point, shoot us up? I mean we worked so hard to create an application, work up a family, gain the money and materials to participate in the point battles to have a fight against other families to claim a turf/point, and then some civilian comes along, pretends they're just watching, then boom, next thing you know your dead while trying to claim because that civilian lied. I mean it's just not practical or even fun. If civialians want to participate in something like that, create something for them. Let it be their own private thing that we can't join in on. It's too unfair for families seeing as we made the effort on SZR. We put hours of our time into creating something big, for a group of civilians to come along and pop us because they're 'helping another family'. If your not in a family, and don't participate in point battles, don't even bother commenting in here, you don't understand my point.

[Satoru]

I always kill civilians on points, don't take this away from me please

[daxter 789]

If even other families agree with my complaint, why not ban civilians? I don't care about reasons why they should be there. It sucks. I mean there could be an OOC reason why civilians hate grove st. or yakuza or mafia, so what, they come down to the point, shoot us up? I mean we worked so hard to create an application, work up a family, gain the money and materials to participate in the point battles to have a fight against other families to claim a turf/point, and then some civilian comes along, pretends they're just watching, then boom, next thing you know your dead while trying to claim because that civilian lied. I mean it's just not practical or even fun. If civialians want to participate in something like that, create something for them. Let it be their own private thing that we can't join in on. It's too unfair for families seeing as we made the effort on SZR. We put hours of our time into creating something big, for a group of civilians to come along and pop us because they're 'helping another family'. If your not in a family, and don't participate in point battles, don't even bother commenting in here, you don't understand my point.

You are right ,i think the reason they to come and to shoot us is cuz they see the guns on the ground and they might want to take our guns too.So from one battle they have free guns for one week or more.But some civilians are helping the families what they like or thet families in what are they going to join soon.Other civils are maybe going to those points to revange the family ,because they have war with the band and they know that the pointbattle is the perfect place to revange.

[Freddo_Brazzi]

This is what I do. If I feel I'm outnumbered, i get some civilians to assist me or faction members. Example today a mafia member splint chesthair helped me fight Aget vs 2 yakuza and 2 grove. It became a fair fight.
What I would do If I had 5 members on, I would shoot all the civilians off as Ari mentioned. This way they don't come back, or if they do, they die. But do make sure that you warn civilians to leave.
This is the only solution imo. Plus civilians interacting at points is an activity and might help server to get more populated. Gang members get bored, so will civilians. Sure it'll be harder to win, but hey, you gotta think and build up strategies.
PEACE.

[80s_Baby]

I have no problem with them spectating, I just don't want to see them joining in.

[Silver_Leo]

basically you don't care whatever anyone else says and your mind is set

well its a good thing your opinion is shit

[80s_Baby]

basically you don't care whatever anyone else says and your mind is set

well its a good thing your opinion is shit

It's not shit, it's quite relevant. Not a problem for you, because you don't participate in the wars.

[Josh_Moore]

Well why don't cops arrest people? Doesn't make sense. If ppl are shooting guns they should arrest them. Civs and cops shouldn't interfere in points full stop. Unless Civs can claim and cops can arrest.

It would be stupid for cops to come and arrest people at a point because they would have to arrest gang members too, it's not like they have a license to kill dozens of people legally, and that would create assloads of butthurt players and fuck the balance between gangs even more, while only arresting civilians would pretty much make the points ooc again since there isn't any rational ic reason for them to do that

[Silver_Leo]

Yes, in my 4+ years here i've never had a point battle, i'm sorry you're so right matt owens.
Even now, I still have some involvement in points and I observe them on a daily basis.

But really what is the point in arguing against you? You either dismiss half the people because you don't consider them "involved", you don't quite grasp what roleplay is or how to use it to your advantage, you decide that cops being half-involved for fairness sakes isn't right either.
Tell you what, would you like to be arrested at point battles? I can arrange that.

If you can't discourage civs from fucking with you at a point, you're either assholes to civs or so weak you can't handle a disorganized pack of idiots for hire, or don't have the intelligence to hire civs of your own.

In either case, it's not a mistake on our side, but on yours.

The focus of the server is going towards in character development - OOC factors are becoming useless in the entire decision process of the way the server will grow. Cops are no longer fired over OOC things. Cops are only judged on in character investigations, in character reports and even when we all know they do bad things, we have to go by the process.

After seeing how much it can change things, I hope your dumb suggestion will be nipped in the bug. There are no ooc safe haven places. I hope points are worked into a way that cops can fully have a part in them. I hope civs will cause you so much trouble you'll have to actually work hard and fight and maybe even risk a loss to get anywhere.

This isn't a server for perma-winning. It's roleplay. There are winners and losers. Just because you're losing, doesn't mean we're going to ruin everyone else's experience to make yours better. If you're just here to win, you probably aren't that useful anyway.

[Ari_Papadopoulos]

repetitive stuff

I've responded to you a couple times with long posts explaining my position, and you have ignored everything I've said and continued to hammer away on the idea that because you made a gang, you're more special than civilians and shouldn't have to fight with them at points. Great. You've made your point, and you've completely failed to respond to anyone talking with you.

Read what Silver said, and if you keep posting without addressing peoples' responses in a reasonably decent way, I'll close the thread.

edited 2 be less mean

[Ari_Papadopoulos]

Oops. Unlocked again.

[Chris Hansen]

If even other families agree with my complaint, why not ban civilians? I don't care about reasons why they should be there. It sucks. I mean there could be an OOC reason why civilians hate grove st. or yakuza or mafia, so what, they come down to the point, shoot us up? I mean we worked so hard to create an application, work up a family, gain the money and materials to participate in the point battles to have a fight against other families to claim a turf/point, and then some civilian comes along, pretends they're just watching, then boom, next thing you know your dead while trying to claim because that civilian lied. I mean it's just not practical or even fun. If civialians want to participate in something like that, create something for them. Let it be their own private thing that we can't join in on. It's too unfair for families seeing as we made the effort on SZR. We put hours of our time into creating something big, for a group of civilians to come along and pop us because they're 'helping another family'. If your not in a family, and don't participate in point battles, don't even bother commenting in here, you don't understand my point.

You are not the only person on this server. You do not get to decide what other players can and cannot do, nor can you dissuade them from commenting on a topic that very much applies to what they can and cannot do. If civilians want to be at point battles and/or fight in point battles, that is their choice. If they get killed doing so, that is a consequence of their choice.

Simply having a consensus among like-minded players is not a sufficient reason to limit a players' movement on the server. The fact that you are not competent enough to fight in a point battle with multiple parties involved is also not a sufficient reason. Present us with a valid reason that civilians shouldn't be allowed at points, besides the argument that you don't like losing.

[80s_Baby]

Eh.. It's a complaints forum, so I will speak my mind. So don't pretend I cant

[Rachael]

this argument has been going on for quite a while.

There are ways to force non gang members out of points, but people will still find ways to exploit it, and it will take away more of the reason for people to play.

much better to deal with it IC, and increase the depth of roleplay for all involved.

[Ari_Papadopoulos]

Eh.. It's a complaints forum, so I will speak my mind. So don't pretend I cant

Oh, this is a complaints forum? Well, in that case, let me just tell you: Your brain is a turd